>> ^shinyblurry:

It wasn't immoral, it redeemed creation, his argument shows no understanding of divine providence. chris chooses to espouse this simplistic viewpoint based on a shallow understanding of His life and work...in no way was it immoral, not under any definition. Jesus said this, that the greatest love is that of someone willing to lay down their life for their friends. Jesus did that because He loves us all, to him we're all his friends. chris's argument is missing the point entirely. We can't get there on our own. There is no on righteous, not one;. Chris is a sinner, and he doesn't want to join God in paradise, he would rather be seperated from God forever..so when God gives him what he wanted you say its immoral. make up your mind
>> ^hpqp:
@shiny: So Jesus Christ is the only one to have allegedly died, nay, sacrificed himself, for others? Wow, that makes him soooo much better, and Christianity the pinnacle of morality!
/sarcasm
Watch and learn:




Jesus is just another avatar for God. How can an omnipotent, omniscient being who CREATED THE ENTIRE FRICKING UNIVERSE possibly be sacrificing ANYTHING or teaching some valuable lesson about living morally by killing a mere material manifestation of himself? It'd be like an adult person impressing an infant by doing the "Gotcher nose!" trick and then expecting, no, DEMANDING the child to be just as sycophantically impressed when he becomes an independent, free-thinking adult.

And why the FUCK would he decide to do this only after humanity has ALREADY had an incredibly harsh, scrounging, feral existence (while he sat on his ethereal ass, no less, watching his beloved creation unfold) composed of much abject suffering, hunger, and violence for the roughly 400,000 years of human development prior? Did an omnipotent god have a momentary (from his perspective, of course!) loss of control? What the fuck kind of interventionist God is he to chose THAT time specifically? Came down with a case of Mondays, maybe? Or did he just not care and decide to mix things up out of boredom? What a narcissistic, manipulative, cynical, uncaring, and abusive asshole your god is if your doctrine is to be believed.

You do not need a god, specifically the Christian god in your case, to be moral. Our continued existence and success as a social species has borne this out. We continue to progress in spite of the hamstringing influence of these unimaginative, sadomasochistic ideas, not because of them. Ideas of flawed and all-too-obviously human minds; superstition and utterly incomprehensible and self-contradictory religion. No divine being had ANY hand in that jumbled mess of a book you revere much. No self-respecting divine being would. Us humans, on the other hand...

Will feral is funny as shit live or in skits like this, as good as he was in SNL back in the day.

Animals, when I first read this reply, I did not know who wrote it. When I read your name, I smiled. Thank you Animals, not just for the apology, but for the insight of how a good man's mind can work when not blinded by the Blizzard-Of-Hate (Or, less that Blizzard, blinded by the rhetoric of his own mind.) For the record, I used to be an unequalled troll. I was God back then, and no one was allowed to have 'silly' ideas outside what 'should be,' but I did have one flaw. I looked to myself and asked questions. And I did not like my own answers.

As to you being immutable--it is true that I assumed you would not readily change

To the well-answered points you made;

Even if this video is a parody, some religious evangy would gobble this response up and spew it back out. But they would probably mean "inspired the bible", and yet still the sift would pound away for a simple mistake of words-versus-meaning. On a side note, I have heard far worse than this video's content from godly men--and it was stated in seriousness. I still cringe...

You bring up the multiple levels of feelings on this issue... To that I say and ask--it is factually true what you say, but when so many tiers/levels are calculated, doesn't the entire tier system become useless? (He is middle class making 40,000$. He is 'above middle class, making 40,005$, and so forth and so on.)

I tier this argument into three simple groups, Those that Believe, Those that Do Not, and Those who Couldn't Care Less. I fall into the Care Less. I know that list is subjective, and probably wrong of me, but I do it simply for simplicity.

Onto control--every nation, country, culture, etc. of humanity has created some form of control. Whether norms, government, religion, taboos, implied demands--or something societal, like commercialism--there has not been a gathering of man that has not exerted control. I am not saying control is evil, mind you--just necessary. In fact, when man is left untouched by any which way by another man (I.e. abandoned from birth, and never in human contact,) he becomes feral, and nothing smarter than an animal.

The control points I bring up are cheap for one reason--it just is easy to say and give examples. Kind of like 'humans need food.' So it is simple of me to say, and offers little but I feel it needs said.

Again, thank you fro proving me wrong.

>> ^AnimalsForCrackers:

Okay, give dummy lady a break. She meant to say "Who inspired the bible" but put foot in mouth.

when i was a kid we lived in what can only be described as an upper middle class crack house with cats everywhere. dozens of them. everywhere.

one day several of the non-feral outside cats turned up missing. we finally found they had all been taken to the pound on different days. 3 of them had already been put to sleep and the rest of them had contracted a nasty case of the kitty aids.

we found out it was a new neighbor down the street who had trapped them all one by one and hauled them off to the pound.

my dad was crazy. and we lived with about a dozen or so drug addicted, gender confused teens/early 20 somethings.
so........... we all exacted our revenge.

my dad had taken to sneaking onto her driveway every night with a vat of ketchup and a stuffed kitten on a noose, hanging the cat from a tree and painting the words (with kethcup) "cat murdering bitch" all over her garage door. we were all encouraged to egg and tp her house. whenever someone would pass out we would drag them into her flower bed and leave them there. my brother, who was addicted to crack at the time, pissed and shit all over front yard a few times. (she had apparently trapped our cats for messing up her flowerbed and spraying her front porch). this went on for weeks. i dont remember why it stopped and i dont recall if she ever did anything about the harrassment. but i thought it was a nice revenge story to share.

Darn. I was hoping to see someone get a faceful of striped feral hooves! Don't try to sneak up on a zebra from behind!

>> ^Gabe_b:

>> ^ForgedReality:
>> ^Gabe_b:
It's like a cat version of The World's Most Useless Machine
Angry declawed cats are the best. Ours was tearing up the wallpaper and my hands till we had her declawed. Now all she has is marshmallows of rage

Declawing is horrible cruelty. I think it should be made illegal. What's wrong with clipping the cat's nails every so often? Don't be lazy. It pretty much shows your lack of affection and concern for your animal.
Please read this: http://www.declawing.com

No doubt it is. I had to watch her pad around on bloody bandaged paws for a fortnight. We did it as a last resort. Living as expats, not sure of how long we could keep an animal it didn't seem moral to get a kitten so we got a shelter cat. Turned out she'd been abused by her first owners fiance, and then spent several months locked up alone in a tiny box. By the time we got her it wouldn't have even been accurate to call her feral as a feral cat has survival skills and will often be quite friendly.
After a couple of months of her tearing up everything, and attacking us for petting, sitting near or just walking part her we asked the shelter guy for advice. He suggested dumping her out on the street, but at 3 years old already, and in a country where it's common to abuse and cut the tails of stay cats for kicks, it didn't seem fair. She was going to live as an apartment cat for the rest of her life, and if every interaction with humans resulted in her panicking and hurting them, making them freak out at her and reinforce her fears, then it was going to be a pretty miserable life.
I have lived with half a dozen cats that have lived since kittenhood in stable situations and never have for a second considered having their claws ripped out to make my life easier. This seemed, after exhausting plenty of other options, to be the best option.
Since we had it done, things have improved considerably for her. She spends most nights on the sofa snuggling with me or my girlfriend and sleeps in bed pretty much every night. She still has attacks of rage, but when she does now she isn't confronted by a yelling similarly pissed of human. If that's too much ambiguity for you then shrug


Sad. I can say I would probably have tried harder to work with her, and teach her we're not all out to get her, but then I wasn't in that particular situation, so I don't really know. The story you relate softens the blow a bit, but it still personally feels a bit extreme. Maybe if I had been in your situation, I would be able to better relate.

I could never have a cat declawed. Even if it took years of therapy and calming down, I would do anything in my power to rehabilitate, rather than chop my cat's toes off. It seems like adding more abuse to an already disturbed animal. But like I said, I wasn't there, so I'll assume you did everything in your power.

I do commend you for taking in a shelter cat and not having it put down when you discovered its mental state, though. That at least shows good intentions.

>> ^ForgedReality:

>> ^Gabe_b:
It's like a cat version of The World's Most Useless Machine
Angry declawed cats are the best. Ours was tearing up the wallpaper and my hands till we had her declawed. Now all she has is marshmallows of rage

Declawing is horrible cruelty. I think it should be made illegal. What's wrong with clipping the cat's nails every so often? Don't be lazy. It pretty much shows your lack of affection and concern for your animal.
Please read this: http://www.declawing.com


No doubt it is. I had to watch her pad around on bloody bandaged paws for a fortnight. We did it as a last resort. Living as expats, not sure of how long we could keep an animal it didn't seem moral to get a kitten so we got a shelter cat. Turned out she'd been abused by her first owners fiance, and then spent several months locked up alone in a tiny box. By the time we got her it wouldn't have even been accurate to call her feral as a feral cat has survival skills and will often be quite friendly.
After a couple of months of her tearing up everything, and attacking us for petting, sitting near or just walking part her we asked the shelter guy for advice. He suggested dumping her out on the street, but at 3 years old already, and in a country where it's common to abuse and cut the tails of stay cats for kicks, it didn't seem fair. She was going to live as an apartment cat for the rest of her life, and if every interaction with humans resulted in her panicking and hurting them, making them freak out at her and reinforce her fears, then it was going to be a pretty miserable life.
I have lived with half a dozen cats that have lived since kittenhood in stable situations and never have for a second considered having their claws ripped out to make my life easier. This seemed, after exhausting plenty of other options, to be the best option.
Since we had it done, things have improved considerably for her. She spends most nights on the sofa snuggling with me or my girlfriend and sleeps in bed pretty much every night. She still has attacks of rage, but when she does now she isn't confronted by a yelling similarly pissed of human. If that's too much ambiguity for you then *shrug*

>> ^poolcleaner:

>> ^ajkido:
The cat didn't scratch the shit out of his face? Unrealistic.

Cats aren't feral beasts if you don't treat them that way, asshole human.


You should try telling that to this kitten @_@

Use your cat whispering skills to grab him and proceed with eskimo kisses.

>> ^ajkido:

The cat didn't scratch the shit out of his face? Unrealistic.


Cats aren't feral beasts if you don't treat them that way, asshole human.

Thx, Laura! Fixed it, have you seen the clip/film? Can highly recommend it!

In reply to this comment by laura:
*dead

Looks like the cat knew what it was doing. Probably feral... eats snakes all the time.

Also looks like he got bit on the chest about 20-odd seconds it, when they swap sides the kitty appears to be bleeding, but it could just be dirt on its fur.

Anyways, impressive snake gittin' skills. My cats are totally hopeless pampered mostly indoor sissies. Occasionally they get some critter and play with it to death or until I take it away. I used to have one though that was a badass hunter. She hardly ate any cat food at all during the summer. Mostly mice and things, but smaller rabbits on occasion. A few times I found her sitting next to a rabbit carcass, blood all over her face, happily munching on its guts looking like a lion eating a gazelle. She always brought her prey to the same part of the yard for eating and it was routinely littered with the dismembered bits and pieces of various animals (a bird's wing here, a mouse's head there, and many other things I couldn't and didn't care to identify).

>> ^geo321:

But have you ever heard of one house cat killing another generally? They strut their stuff and pose but I've never seen them get into a killing mode with eachother. >> ^choggie:
>> ^geo321:
It's interesting, I've never heard of one house cat killing another. Even among strays. I wonder if their species has evolved to the point where they don't kill each other anymore.

-wishful thinking- these 2 cats are in the, getting to know each other with wrinkles phase...Roaming cats treat territory according to their imprints, encounters...etc.-These guys probably established some common ground w/o tooo many scratchety-bites. Kitties do and will kill each other-...every day...domesticated/feral kinna strays man-Nearest city near you.



Growing up on a farm, it was normal for male cats to kill and eat any kittens they could find. So their heightened sense of morality, if they've evolved one, looks different than you've imagined.

But have you ever heard of one house cat killing another generally? They strut their stuff and pose but I've never seen them get into a killing mode with eachother. >> ^choggie:

>> ^geo321:
It's interesting, I've never heard of one house cat killing another. Even among strays. I wonder if their species has evolved to the point where they don't kill each other anymore.

-wishful thinking- these 2 cats are in the, getting to know each other with wrinkles phase...Roaming cats treat territory according to their imprints, encounters...etc.-These guys probably established some common ground w/o tooo many scratchety-bites. Kitties do and will kill each other-...every day...domesticated/feral kinna strays man-Nearest city near you.

>> ^geo321:

It's interesting, I've never heard of one house cat killing another. Even among strays. I wonder if their species has evolved to the point where they don't kill each other anymore.


-wishful thinking- these 2 cats are in the, getting to know each other with wrinkles phase...Roaming cats treat territory according to their imprints, encounters...etc.-These guys probably established some common ground w/o tooo many scratchety-bites. Kitties do and will kill each other-...every day...domesticated/feral kinna strays man-Nearest city near you.

>> ^Deano:
This does beg the question of how they cope without us. If they weren't domesticated what would happen to their nails?


I believe feral cats climb and scratch a lot more stuff and naturally their nails wear down faster and don't need trimming.